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Event The Annihilation Spring 2018 Tournament - Brackets

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by Murgatron, Feb 27, 2018.

Event - The Annihilation Spring 2018 Tournament - Brackets | Page 5
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  1. Murgatron Network Lead

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    Hi TheAlmightyVance,

    Indeed the tournament has been running much longer than we anticipated, there are few reasons for this:

    1. We encountered a crash bug during match 3. This meant that match 3 and 4 both had to be rescheduled. Despite our best efforts to track down the bug we were unsuccessful and so we implemented a method to recover a match. This delayed us by 1 week.
    2. Whilst we had 2 quarter final matches ready to go (team wise) we decided to announce the map only when ALL quarter final teams had been finalised. This delayed us around 2-3 weeks due to the first point and because it exacerbated point 3....
    3. Trying to get all 4 teams in each quarter final to agree on a match date. Sadly for many players May represents the exam period so we had to allow teams some extra time to be ready. Complicating that is timezones.
    Could we have been more pushy with the teams to get a date? Maybe, but at the end of the day this is for the enjoyment of the players, I don't want to spoil this for them!! :stuck_out_tongue:



    As Navarr mentioned above the vast majority of team entries are Japanese and as such we have to try find playtimes suitable for both teams. Allow me to share the private group discussion:


    Your team leader responded to this request with:


    So if you have an issue with your match start time I suggest you take it up with your clan leader.


    Bit harsh o_O considering the amount of time we have sank into this as a staff team from a development and administrative standpoint it's also quite hurtful. Maybe we should take on your last point and just remove your team entirely and just have only JP clans?

    Hasenfuss, Nikogab22, Mistri and 3 others like this.

  2. WWII Platinum

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    How the hell does this make any sense? JP clans play on US Shotbow, why wouldn't the inverse happen on JP Shotbow? Honestly this makes you sound like you are attacking US clans
  3. connor564 Platinum

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    agree here, sounds like you're a bit against the US community murg ._.
    WWII likes this.
  4. DutchSurvivor Obsidian

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    Hmm, maybe people should appreciate the things that are happening, or are being organised for them. Instead of complaining or giving hurtful criticism; if you think that you can do better, do so! If you don't know the answer - no worries we don't either - however, delivering positive criticism/comments will help a lot more!

    If you give them harsh comments; just get out... You hurt their time put into this community and into these events, and most importantly: their motivation. That is the very thing that keeps Shotbow around until this very day!

    People these days...
    Kerb___, Nikogab22 and Fluffoon like this.
  5. _Swipe Platinum

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    Sup Dutch, it's been a minute. I'm all for positivity, but it can't be denied that this tournament couldn't have been run better. Sometimes, you need a little truth to get the gears going.

    The idea of a world-wide tournament in and of itself is flawed. It's just not physically possible to find a time that suits all players from across the globe. That fact, combined with a rushed planning phase towards this is why the tournament is in the situation it is today. Staff, do you agree? The whole bracket system that's in use right now with the way teams were divided is just wack, and there are proven, trusted, and better ways regarding tournament formats available to satisfy most all parties (the kicker is that those better ways usually require more staff time, which of course is big).

    To any worthwhile endeavor there are three phases: planning, execution, and reflection for next time. And there's always a lot more planning that is required for something to be put in motion than anyone initially thinks. Then, in execution, something will always come up. It happens in construction projects, code development, and really any other group effort.

    I wouldn't be too hard on the staff members though, anyone can fuck something up when they don't put in the right amount of time and effort into something like this. Also sometimes, people just aren't willing and/or able.

    Throughout history, many many people (especially I) have fucked up plenty of things with poor planning; the idea is always there and it looks great, but you've gotta spend that much of looking, drawing up, refining, checking, and re-checking everything while communicating those details clearly to your subordinates if you really want something done well. It's just a lot. And I had my doubts before all of this if anyone was really going to put in that amount of concentrated effort to make this event what the players want. We (the players, and maybe even some staff) were looking for this tournament to be something it could not, simply because Shotbow doesn't have the bandwidth to do so at this point. Even if the interest is there, if you don't have the resources and/or aren't willing to invest them you can't do the job.

    Then comes the blame game, back and forth, same-old Shotbow stuff. Now staff motivation is at 0, people are mad, feelings are hurt, etc.
    What next? If I were staff, I'd guess I'd try to finish it up somehow and take at least some lessons learned out of it. If I were the players, I'd ask myself if I really expected anything else. How about you guys?

    Sorry staff, at this point, all we're looking for now are results. And try to be careful, words matter a lot in this; the more you promise, the deeper our expectations get. Trust has been broken yet again (though it's not entirely your fault), player-counts are low, and no amount of nice words and sorries are going to cut it. What's the staff going to do about it? Shotbow was a big place, and it's going to take a big push from everybody to get close to what we want it to be.
    Fluffoon likes this.
  6. Navarr Network Co-Lead

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    The problem is that nobody is being helpful here. We had very few US contestants and we've done the best in those constraints.

    Regarding planning and execution, yes. We've already learned and noted a lot we can do to improve upon next time. Scheduling is one of those things. The staff team knows that the way we're handling it in this tournament simply isn't working.

    But complaining that a Japanese majority tournament is catering to Japanese timezones is just being unhelpful

    Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
    DutchSurvivor, Fluffoon and _Swipe like this.
  7. _Swipe Platinum

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    Definitely. That's more of having somebody think past their own self and look at the bigger picture for a change, which is impossible sometimes. And the classic "this is bad, and it's all staff's fault, woe is me and my worthless premium" shotbow forum dialogue. Maybe next time, have a disclaimer? Something like, "just so you guys know, since most of the contestants are from japan, time zones will be worked to favor them more, etc." And you can prevent some of the complaints, I guess. We americans and EU also need to accept the fact that we are in the minority now too, which is going to take a sec
    Fluffoon likes this.
  8. JonnyDvE Platinum

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    Maybe because they should have played 4 weeks ago...
  9. Murgatron Network Lead

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    This is exactly what we did in this instance?
  10. connor564 Platinum

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    I don't think the point what I was trying to say was clear. What I was trying to say to JonnyCrafter is that, yes, even if they did ask for a time change, they wouldn't have gotten it because of a majority ruling.
    Goliac likes this.
  11. TheAlmightyVance Regular Member

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    So basically on a server with the IP US.Shotbow.net, the majority (which are Japanese) get to choose the times so people on the United States have to wake up at 5 AM? Really? Sounds super unfair and unorganized, but ya know.. it is Shotbow. Where is Saunders when ya need him?
  12. Murgatron Network Lead

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    Actually our advertised IP is play.shotbow.net - universal :wink:

    Once again I do not understand your criticism - your team leader agreed to these times and did not once protest. We offered additional playtimes to be more suitable for US playerbases as well:


    At this point you are just repeating concerns that have already been addressed.
    Hasenfuss likes this.
  13. TheAlmightyVance Regular Member

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    Doesn't make sense, you said the 5 AM time for us was voted on (the Japanese had the majority vote).
  14. Murgatron Network Lead

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    Allow me to clarify, when setting up the Quarter Final match we gave all teams 2 potential times they could play in the following message:


    Your team leader said:
    This means that he agreed that his team could play ANY of the above times, including the earlier play times. Irrespective of what other teams your team signed up for this timeslot.

    I'm afraid to say that whilst an earlier play time does suck for your team the responsibility for that lies with your team leader.
  15. Murgatron Network Lead

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    Hello everyone,

    With regret we are disqualifying Team Envy. After today's match had been played we noted that the account "ItsBeenAMinute" was an alternative account of Unhinge who has already played in the tournament under another team.

    This was despite several warnings before the match - including clarification in Discord DM and even ingame before the match when they asked for another player to be added to their roster last minute from another team and were explicitly told that this was not permitted.

    Sadly this was not just a case of one player being deceitful - the entire team must have known who was playing on that account and why. For that reason we judge the entirety of the team at fault.

    For those who will argue this happened with Oblivion, we have addressed this issue previously here. I make no secret in admitting that we made a mistake due to a misunderstanding and communication error. We did our best to rectify the situation by attempting to re-run the match with the original 4 teams (without Oblivion) and further clarification with all teams on this matter.

    During the course of this tournament we have allowed multiple teams to make roster changes last minute in an effort to keep it enjoyable and as stress free as possible for all involved. It is extremely infuriating and upsetting that we have players who looked to take advantage of our generosity to sabotage and use it for their own gains. Due to this future events will unlikely permit the changing of teams. We will work on the format of the event to ensure a larger pool of players are available to play as back ups and detail meticulously our stance on this.

    Despite these set backs I would like to thank all teams who have competed so far - it has been a fantastic event to watch and a pleasure to commentate on.
    Kerb___, Fluffoon, Camarum and 6 others like this.
  16. Tuv_ Platinum

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    Its murgatron or staffs own fault I am the leader I do not know why they listened to the randoms in my team seems unfair that the whole team is disqualified I never requested roster changes for the match so I do not know why the ruling was made. People on my team has said murgatron has a bias against us and it seems to be true. I was appointed leader so again why did you willingly add people I did not request for?
    ACringyWeeb likes this.
  17. _Swipe Platinum

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  18. connor564 Platinum

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    It's all ogre now
  19. LegendaryAlex Platinum

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    Good leader here bois, very responsible.
  20. Murgatron Network Lead

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    Hi Tuv__,

    Sadly this is a situation where I am damned if I do and damned if I don't.

    If I refused to allow roster changes last minute you would accuse me of bias since I generally try to permit this for all other teams and your team would have been several players short.

    I allowed the changes this time to try and allow your team a fighting chance. Sadly as you were not in attendance for the event and there was no mention of a co-leader I had no-one officially to ask about from your entire clan, hence why I asked the entirity of the team.

    Pyakoumatos requested the additions prior to the match and nobody else from your team raised any concerns of objections both in public or private.

    As such it still falls to yourself as leader of the team to organise and delegate responsibility for your team.

    There is absolutely no bias against your team and any such accusations are completely unfounded and false.

    Once again this is a lesson for us to take forward with respect to rostering changes and last minute changes. Changes will not be permitted and rosters will be set before a tournament begins.
    Kerb___, Horst_Frank, xMike__ and 5 others like this.
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