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Discussion in 'Annihilation' started by Unhinge, Apr 14, 2019.
im too lazy to read someone read this whole thread for me and record it pls thank.
The game isn't directed by the "top-tier players" nor are they the ones who are going to influence future-made suggestions. You won't be favoured to have classes be bent in a certain direction that benefits your own personal future games & might ruin it for others. Depending on your game-style, some are relying purely on classes, others solely on loot, and then the remainder focus is in-between. It's not your efforts that you're being punished for, rather your carelessness.
Who is anyone to tell me i'm playing the game wrong if I'm not phase 2-rushing, getting iron at phase 1, getting diamond phase 3, not building a wall. Nobody, and there is no "correct" or "ideal" way of playing Annihilation. You can be leather by phase 5 and kill a full diamond prot 16 and that wouldn't be "punishing the one doing all the effort". Your carelessness & knowing how certain classes operate, are what gets the player killed. This gamemode isn't designed to be played in solo-mode, everyones efforts combined are what creates a confidentially entertaining game. Some classes could however be tweaked, but I don't recommend changing their entire concept to benefit the "top-tier" players of Annihilation.
your POV still remains subjective. Objectively, there’s room for discussion in regards to this.
There are some really good ideas in this thread, thank you guys for taking the time to post them
You came up with many ideas, some are good and some not so great.
I start with the general balancing:
- some changes to the ranks could be nice but its not a top priority, imo it adresses the new players with some classes and so on and this works just fine as it is
- Regarding the boss armor your right. They are too bad rn and see nearly use and break too quick. The two best enchantments for gathering ressources are fortune and looting. The buff already grants fortune so why no lloting. Really clever point there.
- I would love to see the 8v8 again with all the custom options murg said in the q and a.
Now its time to get a look on the classes. For the start it could be helpful to know that every player has a differnt view on the game and towards what is viable, just as soto mentioned I think, so its easier to disagree in this point:
- Scout: I ve had a talk regarding this class in the update thread and Id like to refer to it because it has some really nice ideas in it.
- Riftwalker: I would doubt that whose changes have an imense impact because this maybe up to 10 seconds of knowledge are clearly not that helpful.
- Alchemist is as it my fave class. Its hands down the strongest class for rushing, you dont have to buy all the brewing items (brewing stand + maybe a ghast tear = 25 gold or 35 bc the stand brews twice as fast) and it gives you acess to gunpowder and glowstone before phase 3.
I can understand ppl who want the "feature" back but as long you dont want to brew a whole inventory full of instant heal 2 its still fast enough.
- Vampire: I really like this change, it still gets passed every defense but it helps on the mentioned maps.
- Wizzard: We all know that the missile hitbox is not working as it is supossed to...
- Dasher rn is, atleast for me, one of the most fun classes to use. I feel quite offended that you say it has a minimal skill cap. Other than scout this class doesnt have a mechenical skill cap but one which regards your cooldown management. Othe rthan arcobat or scout after you teleport you become for 10 seconds a civilian and are very helpless if you couldnt read the situation right you teleported in.
- Miner is fine as it. This doent mean this would be a bad idea.
- Scorpio: I totally agree on the part of removing void scorps which is just a pain in the a**.
Maybe even add weakness 1 on the hooked target?
- Ninja: With this changes it would kinda be on the mobility side of kits which might make it viable, I like it.
- Lumberjack: I dont see lumberjack becoming meta. (*coughcough* ppl cant calculate numbers.)
You could just bring another set of full diamond or even make it unbreaking 3 before. But I still dont see a real argument why we shouldnt give it a try.
Instant damages get reduced by protection enchantments I believe and I havent seen the splash back changes yet so I dont know.
All in all I thank you for your ideas and creating and enviremont to discuss all the things we love.
Immo: I remember the days when you used to rush as immo to get that lost 1hp nexus hit, as you could immobolise the defender and still mine the nexus, i mean with the current state of anni immo isn't doing what it's supposed to do. It denies people the right to interact with there environment but they can still move, like what a scam.
Rift: Making a noise would be a good idea, i think the selecting of riders part is a bit sketch so i'd pass on that.
Dasher: Being able to dash through blocks was the best i'd ever seen dasher and would recommend that it returns. The fact that dasher is where it is currently because the admins believe it has to compete with scout and acro to form a trio, that just tells you there is something wrong with the other two classes if dasher has to be changed to make the game fair or at least somewhat creative.
Vamp: Mining fatigue is a thumbs up.
Party Queue system would be wack, I LOVE IT. Team stacking is already broken so at least make it convenient ^
Alchemist is good as it is, access to tier 3 potions allows to remain relevant and unchanged.
ALSO FOR THE 10000000000 millionth time, when editing your spawn preferences for classes. Allow the player to individually select each spawn preference for each kit or if you're lazy at least account for classes that spawn with multiple class items like farmer, warrior, pyro. archer, etc etc ,. because its annoying to die and have to change your hotbar.
Wizard- I feel like wizard is a very powerful class; I would refrain from buffing it. Flame isn't too hard to hit, but missile is almost impossible. Missile should be fixed.
Dasher- I do feel that dasher has a unique place in the meta currently. While you can't cover ridiculous amounts of distance quickly anymore, you aren't screwing yourself by dashing into a fight either now. I would say its fine... I will admit that I preferred the shorter cooldown, but I only used the dasher to escape before
Ninja- permanent speed scares me. Reminds me of OG scout. Not a good passive IMO, would be frustrating to play against. (This is coming from someone who mains Ninja and WIzard) I think a good passive would be reduced fall damage, but that is it. Maybe, if possible, produce no footstep sounds to be more stealthy.
The boss buff swords are fine... While they aren't must haves, the fire aspect III is generally the second item I go for. Sword of Venom is literally broken and doesn't work, so that should be fixed. The fire aspect does ~11 points of damage over time. It is insanely good. You are not supposed to use it as your main sword, just hit them once and then swap out or stay out of range as the fire kills them. Works surprisingly well.
Boots- Boots are AMAZING. They do tend to trigger when they really shouldn't and end up breaking too fast though.
Helmet- Again, another AMAZING piece of equipment. Perfect as is.
Chestplate- as M7 said, you miss out on too much armor to make the regeneration worth it. The other issue is that the regeneration doesn't stack, so it is only good when you take a single hit then hide for a few seconds. I don't believe that we should just increase the armor on the chestplate as that wouldn't really make it unique. Instead I think that the chestplate should provide a more powerful regeneration effect that refreshes each hit. This would make the chestplate very strong in situations like mid where you take a shot and are able to take cover, but not as good for a deathmatch.
Leggings- I actually like the leggings, but they are underwhelming. The speed allows you to escape from most fights I REALLY like your idea of boosting hunger, plays well into the whole escape aspect of the leggings.
If I didn't mention something in this post it is probably because I agree with it.
But the most logical thing to take from the boss buff is the Helmet. Which is what most people take, so the sword is only good against inexperienced players who are either not rushing with fire res or the bb helmet. Most maps have water at mid so it only takes a few seconds to jump in water, extinguish the fire and bow spam. Plus, sometimes people like to farm outside bases with Pyro because it gives your bow flame and you perm fire res. So overall the Flame Sword is very situational and that late in the game its better to just get the helmet with the amount of fire aspect swords and flame bows.
Ok, I'd like to note to any people who further reply please focus on being objective when looking at any proposals. The main emphasis being on if they improve balance, usefulness and feel good to play with. Many posts have conflated criticism on unrelated points I haven't made which is confusing me.
I'm interested in keeping the game paced quite quickly and convenient, I don't see brewing quickly with alchemist as an issue because you've already taken the time to gather everything to make the potions. Processing them being just a waiting game isn't adding any difficulty or risk but just an unnecessary inconvenience so I'm curious why you think it takes away from the game and in what aspect?
As Sevy posted above I am really enjoying the discussion in this thread so far and I applaud everyone for being good mannered and reasonable about their critique's of each other. Keep it up!!
Murg read this thread for me thank
Already reading. I like to keep out of conversations at times though, they can develop nicely and lead to interesting discussions and new ideas. I'm just spectating for now
well make sure some of these changes are implemented.. they're necessary...
My 2 cents and random ideas
Changes generally look good. Especially boss buff stuff, I always get the bow cuz I'm usually too lazy to make a good one. I do like the torso and legs but they arent exactly good.
I still think scout should have a longer cooldown or be less good at going forward so its not op to just ditch from fights that they dont have fire or slowness.
I wish swapper and scorpio and immo didnt want to just suicide gimp people in leather (murg pls refund my swapper I hate it lol I dont want to just gimp in leather).
Spider is also kinda just garbage. You can sometimes web gimp someone but usually its junk and you feel like your playing the worst kit ever. I feel likethe web placement isnt reliable. You cant shoot them close to you because it tries to place them and sometimes they get stuck on junk that they shouldnt. Maybe even just starting with a stone sword or something would help it to rush better and have more purpose.
Would be nice for some of the skiller kits to have more pvp benefits. With the portal theres usually not much reason to fight with them when you can switch to a better kit. Most kits do have a pvp ability (like farmer) but they def feel under used. Like if enchanter could get extra enchants but couldnt switch kit and keep them to promote staying enchanter. Etc.
You shouldnt be able to run into enemy portals to get away. Is dumb when like a diamond base rushes is going to die and portals.
You shouldnt start with full leather. Just helmet and torso. Make leather super cheap at the gold store. I just hate leathers.
A spawn timer would be cool but prob will never happen would change how the game is paced.
A buff to axes pvp could be cool. Like passive increased knockback or armor penetration or something to make them not op but haev a use.
A buff to the gold shop could be nice. I dont think ive ever bought anything from it lol. Like why would I want to waste gold on chainmail. But if the prices were a bit lower I could see myself stashing some gold to buy basic gear on spawn.
<-- weeb hopping on.
SCOUT: I think scout is fine as it is. I said it in a previous post, make it like a minez grapple where you can only go upwards or vice versa.
RIFT WALKER: I'm gonna leave this one, kind of a weird class to implement in.
VAMPIRE: Vampire is really nice now and playable. Like you mentioned though it is kind of annoying how they can just snoop into the nexus. Totally off topic but I like the idea of vampire having less hearts than a normal person but they have like a 25% chance of life steal. This leads to,
SUCCUBUS: Ok. I had no clue what the hell the name meant so I searched it up. "
Tf??? Why would they add women with sexual intentions into the game? Shouldn't the ability be like put someone to sleep and charm them idk. lol anyways
MINER: My opinion this. Miner is used at the start of game when people are mining iron and then it is completely useless for the rest of the game. I suggest that they get like some sort of change to help miner stay an active role.
SCORPIO: Omg literally the worst kit in the class. It is literally impossible to hook someone unless they aren't aware of you. Get rid of void hooking but please please please buff this guy. I like the idea of slowness. One second might not be that much but it'll help a lot.
IMMOBILIZER: I think this kit is a little overtuned. Definitely a support kit but it can be way too much for a support. Maybe just reduce the duration of the stun. This leads to swapper.
SWAPPER: Swapper isn't really in this meta right now. I think we all know how swapper traps work and people carry around a shovel or shears. I'd say swapper is a support role too and relies on teamwork. I do think it needs a buff but not anything with it's ability. Since it's a support it can get weakness but start off with bits of chain armor.
NINJA: Currently useless right now. Let's start off with shurikens. 2 words. Zero damage. Buff it up jeez. Second, the smoke is pretty much useless with its long cool down. I suggest to reduce the cooldown OR add a speed I to ninja but loses it in heavy gear OR make ninja seem like an actualy ninja. ;-; Like what's the first thing you would think of a ninja? Stealthy and agile.
ROBIN HOOD: When I think of robin hood I think of a man with like a shotbow. The bow is underpowered since it takes less time to enchant a level 30 bow and get a power 5 flame 1 but it takes more time to not get a single death with 50 bow kills to get a power 5 flame 1. Buff something with the bow or just remove it and turn it into a shotbow. Or maybe the final form is a shotbow oo
ICEMAN: There are some maps that have no water which makes iceman useless. It's passive, "hitting someone slows them," maybe you do +1 dmg to the "frozen" enemies or you do +1 dmg on ice.
CIVILIAN: Why does no one ever talk about this useless class no one uses unless they are broke and have no xp? Wow a handy dandy crafting table with you. wtf why would you ever need a crafting table just easily make one or if ur at mid or base there's bound to be one.
oh well my 4 cents.
OVERALL STATISTICS (opinion don't get mad at me)Early game80% miner, 10% scout, 5% civilian (those without miner), and 5% otherMid game100% random class hard to tell.Late game30% Scout, 40% Acrobat, 5% immobilizer, 10% Pyro, 20% assassin/vampire, 5% other
All I have to add is that ninja is fun but weak. You spawn with a GOLD SWORD don't know why the devs thought it needed it but it frustrates me. Make the shurikens throw one per charge and do 1 heart of true damage but keep the range (Thor does two hearts to all in an area with no aiming don't see how this would hurt). Give ninja silent steps, jump boost 3, or both. Make the smoke bomb have a smoke texture for enemies on the edges have it stay the same for teammates.
That was the two cents of a ninja main.
Chainmail? Yikes when was the last time you looked in the store?? There ain't been chainmail in there for a loooooong time! Infact in the nexus update I deliberately made it cheaper to mine gold than iron (assuming you were not miner) to get geared up!
Haha hmm maybe ill try the gold shop out. I totally thought it was garbage so I never even look in it lol. I'm prob also getting micxed up cuz boss buff shop is chainmail.
But on the note of chainmail it would be sick if you could craft the boss buff armors somehow. Even if it was expensive and not really worth doing.
Maybe my mind was clouded by the thought that if I could get my swapper kit I never use refunded I could buy enchanter to go with my new berserker kit. Then I could mine gold for mega xp and buy gear to enchant and SLAY peasants. The blood of my enemies would flow like rivers down the mountains in the spring.
But keep up the good work handsome man.
I like the last two paragraphs.
Separate names with a comma.