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Class Suggestion Chain Swapping

Discussion in 'Annihilation' started by Nasar, Oct 23, 2020.

Class Suggestion - Chain Swapping
?

Do you agree that swapper should be nerfed?

Yes 21 vote(s) 42.0%
No 29 vote(s) 58.0%
  1. Nasar Obsidian

    XP:
    3,729,339xp
    Hello dear Annihilation community, for those of you who like rushing swapper might be your worst enemy while rushing. Swapper train or chain swapping is actually extremely common (kit spam based) which is really annoying and very hard to counter nowadays. People hate gearing up because they just get "swap thor" most of the games. My suggestion is to add a cooldown like Immobilizer class after being swapped 2 times. Adding 10-15 sec immunity after you are swapped 2 times might fix the class and the game. This will allow chain swapping to still be a viable tactic with 2 swappers but will nerf chain swapping with 3+ swappers. A full leather team can do nothing all game and chain swap/ kit spam to void a person who takes the time and effort to gear. You should be rewarded for gearing up to rush, not for staying leather all game. Annihilation was made for acquiring gear and pvp, not for kit spamming as leathers all game. Final conclusion what's the point of putting in the time and effort to gear up if you are just going to get swapped into the void.

    Japanese:
    こんにちは、今日は連鎖スワップの問題について話したいと思います
    ラッシュを好むプレイヤーにとってスワッパーは脅威です。ましてや連鎖スワップなどをされればひとたまりもないでしょう。しかし、連鎖スワップは現に多用されている戦略です。主にプレイヤー達が装備を集めようとしない理由はどれほど装備集めに時間を費やしたところですぐにスワップされ奈落に叩き落されてしまうからです。そこで、私なりの解決策を考えてみました。解決策としては、イモビライザーのように使用されたらクールダウンを与えるのがちょうどいいと考えています。しかし、annihilationで最も重んじられるチームワークをないがしろにはしたくありません。そこでクールダウンの条件を二度に及ぶ連続スワップの後に与えるようにしてみてはどうでしょうか。そうすることで連鎖スワップの戦略的価値を維持しつつバランスの良い職業であり続けることができます
    強い装備を入手するのには長い時間を有します、プレイヤー達が装備に費やした時間は一瞬の出来事で失われていいものではありません。annihilationは装備を集めて他のチームと戦うゲームであって、一つの職業によって戦況が大きく変わるようなことはあってはいけないと思っています。皆さんの意見を聞きたいです。よろしくお願いします


    https://imgur.com/lttTmBg

  2. Savkid Regular Member

    XP:
    907xp
    agreed , should make it so that after being swapped u can't get swapped for a while. Would fix the issue
    PlzDontVoidMeQwQ, Meramii and Nasar like this.
  3. JonnyDvE Jr. Developer

    XP:
    2,551,410xp
    I like the idea, 2 Swappers have a max range of 40 blocks, thats plenty tbh
    Nasar likes this.
  4. RichRamp Emerald

    XP:
    594,775xp
    Double swap chain is already too overpowered I think.
    After being swapper you should receive a cooldown on getting swapped again and being immo'd.

    Getting swapped into a swapper trap is already strong enough on its own.
  5. AgentPanda_ Platinum

    XP:
    620,222xp
    no it shouldn't everyone needs to stop crying
  6. LastStyleBender9 Regular Member

    XP:
    48,849xp
    I mean if you are gonna nerf swapper, then nerf gapples. It's one way to make the game somewhat equal in terms of offense and defense.
    JeTi_Brothers and Mallowpuffs like this.
  7. Nasar Obsidian

    XP:
    3,729,339xp
  8. Mallowpuffs Regular Member

    XP:
    253,127xp
    Is that actually a joke? Do you play the same game that I've been playing? Out of the 15 or so rounds I've played in the last 4 days, 13 have ended by gapplers. I farmed 2 apples myself last round, before phase 3. Seriously, I hope that whole post was a joke.

    Chain swappers are annoying but I'm happy to have them in the game to counter gapples. I've been chain swapped with a gapple and I still absolutely think they should stay.
    JeTi_Brothers likes this.
  9. AgentPanda_ Platinum

    XP:
    620,222xp
    swapper is basically already nerfed. most of the time you'll need a immo because everyone here has reduced kb hacks.
    Kalashhnikov and JeTi_Brothers like this.
  10. Murgatron Retired Staff

    XP:
    1,441,209xp
    (To be clear, this is my personal opinion as a player, ignore the staff tag :wink:)

    Annihilation is all about teamwork and tactics so it's important to remember both sides when considering any change to a tactic.

    Back in the ancient times of 2104, Immob used to have no immunity - so you could just get immob'd indefinitely - see 0:25 here:

    The immunity addition still made it possible for solo rushers to be slowed down in their assault of a base but gave them a chance to get some damage done.


    With that in mind and the recent reworking of the immob ability working on a sliding scale based on armour values, I like the idea of introducing a small immunity after being swapped.

    There are a few ways this could be approached to try and keep a swapper train tactic viable but less frustrating for those rushing:

    1. Small immunity after every swap ( 2 - 3 seconds)
    2. No immunity until you've been swapped X times in Y seconds -
      1. example 3 times in 5 seconds would grant 10 second immunity?
    3. Scaling immunity, based on how often you've been swapped in the last Y seconds -
      1. example first swap, 2 seconds, second swap 3 seconds, third swap, 4 seconds, etc.
    I think any of these would still allow swapper trains to be a viable tactic, albeit a bit harder to pull off, whilst giving some extra breathing space for rushers.

    Alternatives could also include:
    1. Decreasing the swapper distance, meaning more players are required to pull of a longer train.
    2. Increasing the swapper cooldown, meaning this tactic can not be done as much - however this change would likely have the least impact compared to everything else mentioned above.
  11. JeTi_Brothers Platinum

    XP:
    215,697xp

    I don't like the idea simply because swapper is one of the few real counters to strong rushes nowadays. While swappertraining might just be right click, it still requires coordination, timing, no obstacles and a pretty poorly performed rush from the enemy. A single bow could easily break the swapper train in most scenario's. I do understand that it can be frustrating when you get swapped like 5+ times in a row to the void because you could technically still be on your own side of the map. While this may be annoying, how often does it actually happen? I've been back for a few months now and I haven't had it happen to me or anyone ive been in disacord with thus far (this doesn't mean it can't happen to others, it just doesn't seem too frequent).

    Annihilation was made for more things than just pvp. Think about tactics, coordinating with your teammates, buildings defenses and traps and trying to get ahead of the enemies. I've seen people talk about kitspam quite often but if a team properly understand the game the changing between classes between the several phases of the game is pretty crucial if you want to win against a good opponent.

    If you get swapped to the void often, I'd say try to figure out new ways to get inside a base or to get out of these void swappertraps. In most occasions you will already know they have a void swappertrap before you start rushing. There are several classes that can help you counter these traps and the shop sells enderpearls that are extremely strong, maybe try using these sometime, I'm sure it will help. I also think a good way to break a swapper train is to get rid of one of the players along the train. The enemy will quickly have to move positions etc while still thinking about the range, not being blocked by obstacles and still making sure no one has entered their nexus thus far.

    I hope we don't start adding cooldowns to every class as I think a game full of players on cooldown will get more stale. That said if a nerf is deemed necessary, I hope they nerf it in a way that only allows for X amount of swaps in a row before you get an X amount of time cooldown from being swapped. For me a train of 3 with a cooldown of 10 seconds after the last swap seems fair, if it is necessary. I'm completely against being unable to use other class abilities on the person that has been swapped for the reasons I present above. I hope this offers another perspective.


    edit because I didn't read one of your comments:
    This thread isn't about gapples so I will keep it short but while gapples might have gotten more rare on some maps it still didn't change the way the mechanics work, so in reality it is more of a delay than an actual nerf. Just yesterday I've been rushed by a group of which I have been told everyone had at least 3 gapples with them, and in the clan war you could see Stroopie gapple in mid. It might have changed how long they take to get but in reality they are just as strong. I've recently done some testing with a few members of the community and we all came to the conclusion that gapples are still simply too strong. We forwarded that feedback.
  12. GiveLifeB2Music Platinum

    XP:
    1,491,347xp
    Just give unKB buff for 3~6 seconds after being swapped and keep swapper trains.

    Swapper should do is to build a swap trap and work with teammates to make it perfect
    not just Invisible to the enemy team’s base and VOID ppl and make enemy leave game

    Swapper+Thor ,VOID SCP two major cancers of anni lol
  13. RichRamp Emerald

    XP:
    594,775xp
    Chain swapping would be fine if the outcome isn't always immediately being voided.
    Moxei likes this.
  14. jaimejaime19 Regular Member

    XP:
    62,256xp
    FIFY
    Looking at you, leather scouts that mindlessly roll to another base
  15. kirukyi Media Creator

    XP:
    2,296,906xp
    100% agree
    Moxei and Nasar like this.
  16. LSDLSD Platinum

    XP:
    3,138,085xp
    Scouting as leather is not kit spamming and it is a legitimate way to acquire gear through PVP. On the contrary, void chain swapping is kit spamming and no you don't acquire the gear through PVP, it just goes straight to the void!!


    A swapper trap designed to kill the enemy and get their loot would be respectable. But we rarely see these types of traps nowadays, its all just void swap traps.
  17. JeTi_Brothers Platinum

    XP:
    215,697xp
    Ah so whenever you are using the ability of a class to your advantage it is not 'kit spam' but a legitimate way, but when someone on the enemy team does this it is not? You can't have it both ways...

    Also, I don't think there is a single kit that is being used more than scout in Annihilation, so if we are talking about 'kitspam' that class joins the discussion.
    Mallowpuffs likes this.
  18. RichRamp Emerald

    XP:
    594,775xp
    The difference between dying to a leather scout and chain swapping is immense. Yes scout receives speed and a grapple. but when someone who's just iron goes up against 2 leathers the Iron person would win, if it doesn't it's because the scouts are better skilled. when its 1 diamond against 5 leather scouts the diamond person would win as well, Replace the scouts in this scenario with swappers and the outcome is always the same. Iron, diamond or prot 16 with 4 gaps. it doesnt take skill to kill them.
  19. JeTi_Brothers Platinum

    XP:
    215,697xp
    I didn't necessarily mean an actual in game scenario. I was talking about the fact that players allow for 'kitspam' when it is for their own advantage and are against it when it is for an enemies advantage. As for the example you present with 2 scouts or 2 swappers, you can stay clear of 2 swappers but you can't of 2 scouts, so I think there are more factors in play than just a 2v1. We might be getting a bit off-topic though.

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